Kelly Dwyer's Small Forward Rankings
Update: He ranks Danilo Gallinari at 11.
Wilson Chandler is ranked 20th with some rather flattering commentary. Gentlemen, start your engines.
over 1 year ago
gian casimiro
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Hmmm
Good to see some love for the Knicks and even though his write-up of Chandler was mostly negative, he still gave him the spot which is cool.
Kinda surprised he didnt put Gallo in a spot instead considering Chandler’s name has been in trade rumors all summer, while Gallo put up simila numbers, is younger, and considered the future of the team
either Kelly Dwyer thinks Gallo is really a PF
or he’s had another one of his brain farts. Or he put Gallo in the top 10. I’m not going to hold my breath on that last possibility, despite the fact that you could make a case for it.
Chandler’s ranking is pretty reasonable. If he steps his defense up—and I think he can—he definitely belongs in the same neighborhood has Ariza or Artest.
C'mon guys
You guys are being too polite to Dwyer and his idiotic rankings. He puts Batum at like 13, and has Tayshaun Prince, Travis Outlaw and the washed up Shawn Marion all ranked ahead of Chandler. That’s absurd. He admits himself that he doesn’t like Wil, and uses moronic reasoning about him playing in an up-tempo system and as a result having "pumped up " numbers, when in fact the Knicks didn’t even really play SSOL very much last season. Kelly Dwyer is an idiot, and Wil should easily fall into the 11-15 range on that list.
well...
batum is gonna be a beast in portland. but i think wilson anywhere between 15-25 is fairly reasonable.
everybody worries too much about what other people have to say.
/// aighttho.com \\/// twitter.com/aighttho \\
right,
but it’s really his comments on Chandler that bug me, and within the context of his other rankings I just can’t understand the reasoning. He’s got Outlaw three spots ahead of him, and Prince six spots ahead, and at this point in their respective careers I just can’t really see how that makes sense. Although, as you said, who really cares what Dwyer thinks… and I could be letting my particular fondness of Chandler cloud my own objectivity.
i'm with you
believe me! but the guy basically voids his entire argument (or lack thereof) when he ranks guys in such a haphazard fashion.
giving him credit is not the right idea.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
well
The Knicks were still 8th in the league in pace last year and WC got a lot more burn that he would have on a team that didn’t suck. So I think his numbers probably are a bit inflated. Ranking him behind Marion and Prince is kind of dumb since those guys are clearly on the way down. Behind Outlaw is highly debatable, stupid even. Behind Batum, I can live with, tho they should be closer together on the list.
point taken about pace, but still
and I agree with you points about Chandler in relation to Marion, Prince, Outlaw and Batum. Like I said, Wil being ranked #20 isn’t my issue so much as who Dwyer ranked ahead of him, and as you said, ranking Batum ahead of him is fine, but they should at least be closer to each other.
also, on the pace issue
I looked at the rankings, and although they were ranked 8th in the league, the spread between their spot at number 8 (96.1) and the middle ranked team, the Clippers (95), isn’t so great that you can classify anyone on the Knicks numbers as “inflated”. At at pace of 96, the Knicks were at just about an average pace last season. So, I revert to my original point that Dwyer’s claims of inflated numbers is bogus
Kinda idiotic
That he put Corey Magette at 11. He’s better than Chandler at this point but 11 is a bit high for a guy who kinda sucked on a team that sucked worse than the Knicks. And Tayshaun sucks too
I refuse to take anything Dwyer says serious.
Even if Chandler was ranked number 1 I still wouldn’t care
"As humans we strive for success but live with fear. If success was inevitable, fear cannot exist" Michael Kelley
I did
He looks… like a sick passer and not a whole lot else. He was able to beat defenders much faster than him, but he is decidedly a non-threat to score. It’s hard to find a comp for him cuz he really is a unique player, but unique doesn’t necessarily equate to elite. Damn the kid can pass, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen someone so one-dimensional in that particular facet of the game.
And it was only one game.
"But when he saw it, he just put his hands up and they couldn’t give it to him. It just fell to the ground, I-I don’t, you know … So, that showed me he had great experience..." - Jeff Van Gundy
by Anthony Bonner's Subpoena on Aug 23, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed
Based on the one game he looked like an old school Jason Williams type player. Lots of flash, he made some nice moves and sweet passes but didn’t do anything else that blew me away. His defense was better than I thought. Who knows, he might still need some time in Spain. He was the MVP for his Spanish league but against bigger, better competition he didn’t look that great
i respectfully disagree
it was startling how much better the team played when he was on the court, even if the reason wasnt totally apparent.
his defense was great, he had 4 steals, and he made his jumpshots.
makes me wonder about the top 10
1. Lebron
2. Durant
3. Carmelo
4. Paul Piece
5. Danny Granger
6. Gerald Wallace
7. Rudy Gay
8. ?
9. ?
10. ???
One of the following is obviously going to get dissed: Gallo, Josh Smith, AK47, Luol Deng. Probably forgetting someone else too. But honestly if Dwyer rates Gallo below Travis Outlaw he needs to get his head checked.
I highly doubt Gallo will make top 10
It’d be awesome but I doubt it. Dwyer wouldn’t give a Knick that much credit.
Maybe Jamison will be in there, Deng, shit I cna’t think of any others. Maybe Gallo will make it!
can't*
And I think Josh Smith and Kirilenko are considered PF’s. Although, Jamison sometimes is too so who knows
Dwyer wouldn't pass up a chance to shit on the Knicks
so I doubt Gallo will make it. I think of Jamison as a PF. Especially since you gotta assume Veresjao will be starting at C this year. Man, the Cavs are gonna suck this year. Anyway…
Kirilenko will play the 3 with Jefferson and Milsap at the 4/5. I know the Hawks want to play Smith at the 3 and Horford at the 4, but they really have nobody to play center so who knows.
I think AK will come off the bench as the 3 or 4
Probably CJ Miles at 3, Millsap 4, Jefferson 5, until Okur comes back. Then, Jefferson gets pushed down, and Millsap to the bench.
And I don’t really think the Cavs will be that bad. I think they should start Jamison at the 3, with JJ Hickson at the 4 and either Varejao or whoever else they have at the 5. Then they’ve still got Mo Williams, Sessions, Parker, Jamario Moon (though that might be a stretch to call him a good rotation player) and Joey Graham. I think they can win like 37 or 38 games which is better than we can say the last few years. And they have Byron Scott coaching.
The Raptors on the other hand…. They’ll be piss poor I think
Mo Williams will have to remember how to be a real PG again
and he’ll look around, and his #1 option will be an over-the-hill Antawn Jamison. I really don’t see that working out too well, but who knows.
Hey, I was pretty damn close!
Apparently Iguoudala is a small foward, and Josh Smith a PF. I am totally fine with Gallo at #11. In fact I change my mind, Kelly Dwyer 4 president!!
I think Dwyer is actually pretty right on
You dudes remember that Chandler can’t shoot right? I love the guy and he goes to the tin with authority, but its not like he’s an okay shooter, he’s a bad shooter. Thankfully he stopped shooting 3s in the second half last year, so if he continues that trend then maybe you bump him up some spots, but until then he’s a below average starter, especially at the most plentiful position in the league. And he’s okay on D, not good. He could be good, but he’s not by any means a noteworthy defender. He may be noteworthy to Knicks fans in that he actually tried to even play defense, a trait our players have lacked for about 8 seasons now, but that doesn’t make him good.
And Gallo? I lurve him too, but I can’t base said lurve simply on production, it’s mostly potential. Dude made a lot of threes, but he also took so many threes. 2nd most in the league. And he only made 38% of em. And he’s not great on D either. Yea he wants to be good, but that doesn’t mean he is (though he is living proof that “defense is about how much you want it” is BS). The flashes of brilliance from him happened more frequently throughout the season and it makes everyone real pumped for his development, but he hasn’t “arrived” yet. He will, though.
And yo, have you guys read anything Dwyer has done? Guy knows his ball. His perceived “hate” for the Knicks is pretty hilarious to me. We just have had bad teams.
"But when he saw it, he just put his hands up and they couldn’t give it to him. It just fell to the ground, I-I don’t, you know … So, that showed me he had great experience..." - Jeff Van Gundy
by Anthony Bonner's Subpoena on Aug 23, 2010 1:41 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I do think he was too light on Felton, though
"But when he saw it, he just put his hands up and they couldn’t give it to him. It just fell to the ground, I-I don’t, you know … So, that showed me he had great experience..." - Jeff Van Gundy
by Anthony Bonner's Subpoena on Aug 23, 2010 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions
no, sorry
Dwyer is a moron. Chandler may have taken too many 3’s the last couple of years, but that doesn’t mean Outlaw, Marion, Prince and Jefferson should be ranked above him, and to then make the unsubstantiated claim that his numbers were inflated due to an “uptempo” system, when in fact the Knicks were at about an average pace last season. That’s just lazy, presumtuous writing, which equals up to Dwyer not knowing sh*t. There is indeed an anti-Knick sentiment among national basketball analysts, and Dwyer is among them, in my opinion.
Yeah Dwyer sucks straight up
I’ve read his other stuff. Some of it can be OK but most of it is cynical, presumptuous writing. And those guys at Ball Don’t Lie are like the least funny writers ever. I can’t even read some of it because they try to be so witty and tongue-in-cheek and they suck
I think you're either paranoid
or haven’ ben watching the same Knick team I have for the last 10 years.
"But when he saw it, he just put his hands up and they couldn’t give it to him. It just fell to the ground, I-I don’t, you know … So, that showed me he had great experience..." - Jeff Van Gundy
by Anthony Bonner's Subpoena on Aug 23, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions
not paranoid,
just paying attention. The Knicks sucking is no excuse for the kind of unfair criticism and stuff that I see and hear everywhere. That’s what I’m talking about—unfair criticism and exaggeration of every little controversy. There’s a double standard applied to the Knicks and their players constantly.
I wasn't just talking about his Knicks coverage
In general he writes more negative things about players than positive
I have agreed with Dwyer in the past, but all of his position rankings have been pretty ridiculous, man
his criteria has been pretty much whether or not he likes the guys. And thats fine since it is his column, but in terms of relevence, his ratings hold no sort of weight with me.
He offers little or no reasoning why he ranked guys high or low. He pans guys for how they played last season, yet still gives them high rankings over other guys who played terrific (aaron Brooks). He will admit guys played awful last season and will still be bench players this season (Sessions), yet they go higher than a guy about to switch to his preferred up-tempo- game (Ray Felton). Jarett Jack gets ignored even though he outplayed Calderon ALL season. Lou Williams gets high marks even though he spent much of the season on the bench not playign well when he DID play. Guys like Wall and Collison get high parks for their potential THIS year, and Devin Harris/ Tony Parker get top 10 nods even though they seemingly did everythign wrong last year amongst injuries. Thats just the PG ratings, but where is the consistency?? there is none. I don’t find his SG & SF picks inspiring either for many of the same different reasons. It really does seem to be based on his personal preferences rather than stats. Again, thats fine since its his column, but otherwise, it seems like a weak list at best.
"you're the Rod Thorn in my Chris Bosh side."
by Chris Child's Fist on Aug 24, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions
At least LeBron isn't in every photo
like Mayo and Lawson.
War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.-1984 George Orwell.
Sad state of NBA SF's
Wow, I didn’t realize how bad it was.
After LBJ, Melo, Durant and Pierce there isn’t a worthy contender to the SF throne.
I think Caron Butler, Rashard Lewis (is he even a SF?), Shawn Marion and Grant Hill are the only other active SF’s with multiple All-Star appearances aside from the quartet above.
Wooo!
It’s nice to see Gallo getting some credit. 11 sounds about right. The only bad thing is Rudy Gay getting shitted on by KD
Bonita Applebum, you gotta put me on.
by King Henry the 2nd on Aug 23, 2010 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Nothing to get excited about.
I could care less what Dwyer thinks. He isn’t Obama.
"As humans we strive for success but live with fear. If success was inevitable, fear cannot exist" Michael Kelley
by MikeTheIntern on Aug 23, 2010 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions
It would actually be interesting to see what Obama thinks.
He watches sports, It would be nice to see what the prez list would be.
"As humans we strive for success but live with fear. If success was inevitable, fear cannot exist" Michael Kelley
by MikeTheIntern on Aug 23, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Calvin Coolridge
definitely has the “Clyde-factor” going for him.
i bet Chandler is a fan of this Always Sunny in Philly exchange:
Charlie: All right, Gladys, can you head out there and get us started?
Gladys: Oh, I forgot to tell you. Calvin Coolidge was a good friend of mine.
Charlie: You’ve been telling me that Calvin Coolidge was a friend of yours, like, all morning, and at a certain point—
Gladys: How many times?
Charlie: Like, a hundred times now.
Gladys: Oh…
Charlie: Well, at a certain point, I need you to stop telling the Calvin Coolidge story, and you need to start playing the piano—
Gladys: Shh!
Charlie: Don’t shush me, OK? Now, please don’t shush me.
by latrell chokewell on Aug 23, 2010 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Chester Arthur is the dark horse
"He's the straw that makes the drink go."
by Thelonious Dunk on Aug 23, 2010 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions
he'd rank Luol Deng #1 at small foward
Totally biased in favor of the Bulls.
I think it would be more interesting to see him solve the oil mess.
Nah, that would be too boring. Let’s see his bracket!
Either way
this basically SHITS on anyone who wants to say that Gallo ain’t respected. 11th isn’t elite, but for a player his age being 11 means he’s in some fairly select company right now.
the 11th takes his age into account, so if he does exactly the same next year as last year, he’d be ranked lower
and if he adds 5 points and 2 rebounds per game
he’s danny grangerous
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
maybe
but he’s still by far the youngest player among those up there.
But I doubt he does exactly the same as last year. He showed too much at the end of the season.
by FreeBradshaw on Aug 23, 2010 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Both rankings seem reasonable.
Gallo’s right on the line between elite and very good, and that 11th spot expresses that well. Love to see the Wil love, too.
"He's the straw that makes the drink go."
by Thelonious Dunk on Aug 23, 2010 5:32 PM EDT reply actions
Alright Dwyer
I’ll give you some respect for the 20 and 11 rankings.
Good to see the Knicks get some love, though it’d be nice if he paid them better compliments than their 15ppg scoring average and their ages. Other than that, he basically criticized Will and Gallo
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