#c'monson
by flossy on Sep 19, 2010 9:44 PM EDT
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PrintSo this doozy of a 2010-11 preview did not make it into the round-up, perhaps because the (allegedly Canadian) writer chose to start off with "In a way, failure was almost inevitable..." and proceeded from there to take a dump on your hopes and dreams; basically saying that Amar'e is an overpaid non-franchise player, the Knicks have nothing left to trade for anybody ever, and that ultimately:
"For all their positioning, the Knicks are only slightly better today than they were on the court over the last two years. They replaced David Lee with Stoudemire, Chris Duhon with Raymond Felton and overwhelming hope with a disaffecting reality."
I know, right?! And somebody hold me back, because:
"Some players need all kinds of statistical analytics to point out their relative value on the NBA landscape. For some, though, a simple narrative suffices. Felton was the starting point guard for the Charlotte Bobcats, a team that just made their first-ever post-season appearance. Despite not having any viable replacement, though, the Bobcats made little to no effort to retain Felton's services this summer as a free agent. They essentially opted to have no tested option at the point rather than re-employ Felton at the position. That tells you everything you need to know about Ray Felton."
Grr! Of course, all you *actually* need to know about Raymond Felton is that he's very fast, is a lock to score 12-14 points a night even if he's not a great shooter, he plays very good defense, and can really pass the rock and run an offense. His career 31.1 AST% is either right up there with or better than many established PGs considered better than him (Derrick Rose, Chauncey Billups, Andre Miller, Mike Bibby, Aaron Brooks, Tony Parker), and better than so many of the young studs everyone covets (Stephen Curry, Brandon Jennings, Jrue Holiday, Jonny Flynn). The Bobcats didn't try to resign him because apparently they decided one playoff appearance was quite enough and that it was time to let their starting PG and Center go. Who knows what that's about. Raymond Felton will do just fine, thanks, so fuck off.
Also, this:
"The talk that Gallinari is somehow an NBA star in the making has never really fit in with the "reality" that most use to observe the NBA. Gallo is a quality three-point shooter (38%), especially since he's more than willing to jack a three whenever the shot comes available (6.0 attempts per game), but as an all-around force he has yet to really make a mark in the league. Last year, he and Wilson Chandler were given any and every opportunity to emerge as deadly forces on a bad team, yet neither one was able to be much more than above average at any point in the season. Keep in mind, too, that as Gallo's minutes increased, his per-minute production dipped. Maybe having a full season under his belt will allow him to show more than he's shown so far as a pro, but as of yet he's really just a solid pro, not a superstar in the making."
Yeah, 15 ppg and 2nd in the NBA in 3s made is definitely nothing to write home about for a 6'10" 21-year old in basically his rookie season... wait, what?
Despite all that and more, we're left with this take-away:
"New York was a 29-win outfit last year, and while they may be able to post an 11-13 win improvement to nab an eighth seed in the post-season, is that really worth the decade of misery that this fan base has endured?"
Well the misery's over, ya biatch! And if even you think our "terrible" PG, "overrated" SF and "overpaid" PF can take us to 42 wins and the playoffs, I think it's time to get ready for an excellent season.
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it's such a terrible article
i’m sick of these writers piggybacking on the idea that not getting Lebron is the equivalent of failure. at best, it’s a narrow-minded perspective – there must be other ways to win a title besides having Lebron, considering that LBJ has NEVER won a title.
the other ridiculous bit that many talking heads espouse is that the time we spent losing isn’t worth what we got in free agency. yeah, we have been terrible for a decade, but the first eight years weren’t sacrificed in any way. those were legitimate attempts by layden and IT to win games, not ploys for the 2010 free agent class. to lump those in with the last two seasons is essentially pandering to Knicks haters. and of course, saying that we gave away the last two years isn’t fair either – there’s no way that donnie could have elevated this team to a 50 win level through “win now” trades, so his best option is clearly to blow it up. winning 29 games with cap flexibility is far better than winning 39 with zach randolph, jamal crawford, and cap hell.
i could criticize so much more of this article, but those are the most egregious fallacies being spewed about the knicks right now, and i’ll leave it at that. suffice it to say that most of the scorn we have been receiving from media types is somewhere between slanted and completely unwarranted.
by latrell chokewell on Sep 20, 2010 12:43 AM EDT reply actions
I totally feel you, just remember...
In Donnie we trust.
by $100M Contract on Sep 20, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
(If only it was a rooster...)
In Donnie we trust.
by $100M Contract on Sep 20, 2010 7:26 PM EDT up reply actions
I can sort of get the gripe of DLee vs. Amare
tho the difference is still underplayed, Lee is not in Amare’s class as a player.
But Duhon vs. Felton? For real? C’mon son.
And how many 21 y/o 6"10 players shoot like that in basically their first year playing NBA basketball? The true answer to what Gallo is, is at worst a very good 3pt shooter. That’s all you can say.
Toney Douglas
HERE'S all you need to know about Ray Felton vs. C Duhon
RF: PER = 15.25
CD: PER = 10.72
RF: TS% = 52.5
CD: TS% = 50.1
RF FG % = 45.9
CD FG % = 37.3
But why bother with facts when a “simple narrative will do”? Pus bag.
Here’s a simple narrative too: Charlotte is so cheap they just fired their season ticket sales staff.
Whatever. Let’s toss up the ball, see how we do.
by AtlKnicksFan on Sep 20, 2010 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I feel like people forget that it was basically his rookie year
And a lot of the reason his TS dropped % was that teams figured out he was our only reliable option other than the PNR, which was stifled b/c Chrissie D. couldn’t score if he was the only man in a world full of sex-crazed former nuns.
Plus Turiaf was one of the best passing bigs in the League before he got hurt. He’ll be replacing Al, who apparently was told that he’d have money deducted from his paycheck if he ever got an assist.
Just drooling over how beautifully we COULD play with so many good passers and decent shooters on this team.
Hope we stay healthy, make shots, and Turiaf / STAT / AR take turns demoralizing the Derick Roses of the world by slapping their shots into the mezzanine when they try to drive into the paint.
Can we PLEASE start the season tomorrow????
by AtlKnicksFan on Sep 20, 2010 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Critics = Trolls who are actually paid to cause uproar (generating hits)
Pay them no mind. Your just feeding the trolls what they want by acknowledging their opinions…
by ap3604 on Sep 20, 2010 8:53 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
Man I cant wait for DG to be the 2nd coming of Peja...
by ap3604 on Sep 20, 2010 8:56 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
dont sell him short
I would love for him to reach a peja status. But I want him to have an overall game that goes from the 3pt line to the paint.
"they try to do what he do, and been where he's been, but they get folded in two.....he's the dude"
wow...
the double standard applied to the Knicks as opposed to every other NBA team is astounding. The last paragraph excerpt is the best example in this case. What is the logic there? That the whole thing is a worthless failure unless the Knicks immediately catapult to the NBA finals this season? That’s ridiculous. Any other team would be praised for becoming young, athletic and financially sound, but because its the Knicks its seen as some sort of failure. And what does the past decade really have to do with anything at this point? The plan we are looking at only went into effect two seasons ago, and I’d say the team we are about to see in training camp is quite an accomplishment in that light. Another good example of the Knicks double standard is the authors comments about Gallo. A 21 year old player on any other NBA team who did what Gallo did last year, would be talked about regularly as a budding star, yet since he plays for the Knicks he’s just nothing special—and it’s obvious that writer didn’t pay close enough attention to the Knicks last season if he thinks Gallo is just a 3 point threat. In the last 1/3 of the season especially, Gallo showed he can be an all-around threat, and even play some good D. but I guess why be bothered with details when you can just glibly trash the Knicks organization.
Gets the blood boiling
Feel like telling all those “experts” that I’m keeping a list of those who talked shit about the Knicks…
Seriously, would almost like to have thread where we just list their names, URLs and predictions, and then we all blast them with posts every time we win, and two posts for every win that puts us farther above .500. The posts would read like this: (excerpt from their prediction): “Nice call, genius” or “Gee, you really know alot about the NBA.” or "Waiting for your new “analysis.” " or “Biiiiyaaaaatchhhhh!!!”
that'll take alot of work
better just make a list of those who didnt talk shit about the knicks..
but that may get boring : /
"they try to do what he do, and been where he's been, but they get folded in two.....he's the dude"
That preview is crap... but....
Am getting a little nervous about Ray Felton. The more I look into all the numbers, the more it becomes apparent that he really is a very poor shooter. Duhon did everything right but shoot the ball well, and we see where that gets us in MDA’s system. Mason Jr. is a poor shooter percentage-wise as well. DWTDD is a better shooter but much worse passer and floor general. I hope MDA’s staff can help him improve his shot.
Still, maybe we’ll see a little bit of Rautins at PG this summer if his knee holds up…
but...
Felton did improve his shooting significantly last season. If he can replicate that, his shooting will be adequate for the Knicks needs
well... he also reduced his 3pt. attempts to an all-time low and only made 60 all year
His improvement finishing around the basket was very heartening. His improvement shooting from range was probably a mirage, especially if he starts jacking them up in this system. If he can just keep his 3pt% north of .350 or .360 I’ll be pleased. I hope Phil Weber shows him a thing or two, but honestly even if he never becomes a lights-out shooter, he is still SO MUCH better than Chris Duhon it is not even funny.
Yeah really
I mean, no one can be worse than Duhon was last year at shooting from the outside. He didn’t even hit enough to keep guys honest. Duhon seemed to be psychologically incapable of getting himself out of a slump.
The way I see it, a 33% 3 point shooter is as good as a 50% two point shooter. In other words, good enough to keep the other team honest.
Felton’s an improvement. I don’t see any way he isn’t.
"He didn’t even hit enough to keep guys honest."
Exactly. I don’t expect Felton to light it up from outside all the time, but I do hope he keeps his average high enough to be at least a credible threat. If he can keep defenders fighting to get over picks by occasionally sticking a 3 when they don’t, it’ll do wonders for our PnR game.
Felton also played on an offensively inept team.
On this squad, hopefully he’ll only be asked to take what the defense gives him.
"But when he saw it, he just put his hands up and they couldn’t give it to him. It just fell to the ground, I-I don’t, you know … So, that showed me he had great experience..." - Jeff Van Gundy
by Anthony Bonner's Subpoena on Sep 20, 2010 9:58 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
I think many times, he prolly felt he HAD to carry the team offensively and needed to score. So that may have led to him throwing up more shots than he should have – low percentage shots.
And it was mentioned before, how many of those shots were taken as the shot clock was close to running out in the slow system Charlotte used?
I think for us with Amar’e, Gallo, etc… Felton won’t NEED to score, which will keep his shots of the higher-percentage variety.
Here's the thing
When Duhon was shooting well, the Knicks played well. When we wasn’t, which was like all of last season, they didn’t. The reason, I think, is that Duhon was actually just a terrible fit for this system. He could not or would not ever take the ball to the rack like he meant it, and he actually seemed to hate/be terrible at creating offense in transition.
As much as MDA’s system thrives on good shooters and particularly a good-shooting PG, it also needs a PG that will push the ball relentlessly, control the tempo of the game, and create for his teammates in that not-quite-a-fast-break, not-quite-half-court moment before the defense is really set.
If I never watch Chris Duhon halfheartedly push the ball up and then turn down an opportunity to attack the basket and/or dish, and then meekly pull back out to the perimeter to let the defense set up, it will be too soon. SO MANY promising possessions were strangled in the crib thanks to Duhon’s fundamental inability to be the aggressor on offense. Honestly that pissed me off more than his inability to hit a damn shot last year.
Luckily, what Chris Duhon did is NOT what Ray Felton do.
I hear ya
2 of every 3 possessions, they run the pick and roll, Lee rolls, defenders go under the screen cause Duhon cant shot, Duhon drives towards the basket, passes up a lay-up or chance to get fouled, runs under the basket, past the baseline and back out to the 3-point arc
I was watching a Gallo highlight mix the other day (no shame)
and my boner for the Cock was temporarily killed by one sequence where someone whipped the ball over to Duhon on the wing in transition, he had a path to the basket open and half a step on his man, and he just… stopped. And picked up the ball, and looked around. In that moment you could practically feel the entire arena shout OH COME ON. He ended up kicking it over to Gallo who drained a 3 from practically half-court, which is why it ended up in the mix I guess, but UGH.
yep
not a good finisher – so when his outside shot went south, the other team could ignore him and stop Lee, leaving the Knicks with no option but a Harrington drive or a contested Gallo jumper.
When Duhon's shot was respectable
Our offense ran pretty well and on a whole, we played decently. That’s when the pick and roll with D-Lee was most dangerous. When Duhon’s shooting was bad the only thing I can give him credit for is being able to jam a pass between two defenders.
And of course I credit Lee for having some of the best hands in the league. I’ll miss that guy….
I think more people need to read this.
This post mixed with these comments make a great thread. Rec’d ya biatch!
"Dedication To The Don" Most Popular Post Of All Time On P&T. I Am Honored
Dude's from Canada and writes for a fake-ass ESPN=TSN
He should be worried about his Bum-ass Raptors instead of hating on the Knicks.
WHY YOU MAD SON?
2010-11 Raptors =
Worst team in the league this season
I can't tell if that's sarcasm or not
But if it’s not….
They couldn’t even make the playoffs with a top 4 PF and Hedo Turkoglu, who despite a bad season, is still a very good player. Now they have Jarrett Jack, Jose Calderon, Leandro Barbosa, Sonny Weems, Demar Derozan and Andrea Bargnani. They’re gonna suck.
i wouldnt count them out yet
sonny effin weems mayne!
"they try to do what he do, and been where he's been, but they get folded in two.....he's the dude"
Just thinking of bad teams....
I got depressed for D-Lee when I looked at the Warriors roster this year. Steph Curry, Ellis, Lee and Biedrins (if he’s healthy). After that… it’s pretty bad. They might actually be the worst team this year
naaah!
reggie williams is a baller! rodney carney fits the style, as does radmanovic. amundson might prove helpful. and they used to think brandan wright had potential. maybe he still does???
all i’m sayin is they won’t be the worst in the league.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
I hope not for Lee's sake
But I just don’t see them improving from last season with the loss of AR and Turiaf, even though they were injured alot. Also they lost Morrow, CJ Watson (I think?) and Tolliver. I forgot about Amundson, that’s a good pick up and Brendan Wright is okay. Still, though, they won’t be very good
not sayin they will be good
all i’m sayin is they won’t be the worst in the league.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
Yeah, kinda feel bad for DLee
Even with the huge contract, his streak of non-playoff games won’t be ending any time soon.
by AtlKnicksFan on Sep 22, 2010 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
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