A Missed Season would suck, but it may turn out great for the Knicks
by Robert Curre on Aug 5, 2011 4:06 PM EDT
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Billy Hunter said this week that there may not be a 2011-12 season. While that is just posturing at this point, he may be onto something. It seems that there is a much larger group of owners who are willing to sacrifice a season to get the deal they want, than owners who are willing to compromise to save the season.
Now a missed season would suck for us as fans, but probably would be a good thing for the Knicks. Whether that is true or not depends on who Dolan decides to replace Donnie Walsh with, and that guy's skills as a negotiator once an agreement is in place.
Now I am sorry Dizzy, but if the season is missed, D'Antoni will probably be given an extension of at least one year. Dolan actually likes D'Antoni and probably would be willing to give him at least one full season with the team to prove himself.
Now assuming the owners get their hard cap of 62 million, and missing a season would make that possible as it appears that only the Lakers would be over the hard cap and that is only if they pick up a couple of players options, the Knicks would be about 18.7 million under the cap. That number includes salaries for (Amare, Carmelo, Douglas, Balkman, Shumpert, Harrellson, and Jordan). That would give the Knicks 7 players with a minimum of 5 to sign and a max of 8 for a full roster. Here is how you guys can get what you want, but the Team President is going to have to be one hell of a sales man.
1. Convince Chris Paul to sign for 7 Million. Why he could be convinced- Greater exposure in NY could increase his off the court earning potential which could eclipse the money that he gives up in guaranteed salary. He has already stated that he wants to play with Amar'e and Carmelo in NY. D'Antoni (assuming he is retained) has an offense Paul was born to run. Lastly, the Knicks probably give Paul his best chance to win a title, given his potential landing spots, Championships also increase a stars off the court earning potential. Could he be convinced to leave upfront money on the table to come here, I say we have a 60% chance.
2. Sign Marc Gasol for 6 million- One of the reasons we need Paul to leave some money on the table is so we can sign a Center. Now with a missed season Gasol is back in play because he will be an unrestricted free agent. Now he will be an even harder sell than Paul. Memphis will have the ability to offer more money upfront, but he could be had by the Knicks if we sell him hard enough. You know Gasol hates the fact that brother Pau has two rings and he doesn't have any, by joining Paul, Stoudemire, and Anthony in NY the Knicks would instantly become a favorite to win the eastern conference which puts him in position to win a title. New York is an international city, which increases his value as an international endorser, brother Pau saw the value of his off the court income double since coming to LA The same could happen for Marc. Chance of landing Marc Gasol for 6 mil, about 35-40%. Not great, but the odds give a creative personnel guy a punchers chance.
That leaves 5.7 Million to fill 3-5 roster spots.
3. Resign Landry Fields for 1.8 Million. Probably doable, Landry would receive a nearly 1.4 million dollar raise.
That leaves 3.9 Million.
4. Resign Jared Jeffries and Shawne Williams for league veteran minimum (proposed 1.2 mil by the owners. That gives the Knicks 12 players and they are still 1.5 mil under the hard cap.
5. Sign Roster filler with the remaining 1.5 mil (3 players at 500K a piece) you know D leaguers undrafted free agent types (hell I will even let you have Earl Barron if you wish!)
Total Knicks salaries = 62 Million.
So you guys get your 3 superstars and a legitimate "young," starting Center. Now Championships are not guaranteed, but that group should be able to take a legitimate run at one.
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Missing a season would only be good for the Knicks
so no one gets hurt. Other then that…this season is already destined to be a missed season for the Knicks whether they play or not, its obvious they’re just waiting for CP3 to make his decision.
I’d rather see them play the missed season, at least there’s basketball.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
What in the world makes you think Paul would settle for $7 million?
He’s the best PG in the NBA and a top 5 player. He’s gonna take a $10 million annual paycut, to come here? Maybe he’ll forfeit a little money, but not around like $40-50 mil (which he would end up losing over 4-5 years).
Gasol is also gonna make a lot more money from another team. He won’t take that much of a paycut either.
Obviously if the Knicks could get Marc Gasol and Chris Paul, we’d be in great shape, but that’s not realistic at all. I’d even go out on a limb to say it’s less than a .00005% chance of happening. And that’s coming from a guy who honestly thinks we’re getting Chris Paul.
It is true that the Knicks would maybe benefit from a missed season, but not for the reasons you stated. We’d be in a good position because we’d be able to have cap space (theoretically, assuming the cap isn’t too low) in a free agency pool that includes both 2012 and 2011 FAs, Chris Paul/ Deron/ Dwight would all lose a year with their respective teams which means there’s a huge chance they’d all leave their teams, also we’d get a chance at getting a high pick in the draft (and if not top 5 it goes to Houston, I believe) and our team/core is relatively young to withstand missing a season. All that being said, as a BASKETBALL FAN I do not want to miss any games or a whole season.
More like 17 million
The contract I propose is a 5 year 50 million dollar contract. If the owners get there way the most Paul could make with a new team in a five year deal is 67 Million. Now Of course the Knicks could do a sign and trade for Paul which would allow them to offer him 86 Million over 6 years. Now if you are saying that Paul who has publically stated that he wants to play here with Carmelo and Amar’e needs more than 86 Million to sign then you guys should give up on him altogether.
As for Pudgy Gasol, I threw his name out there because I know you guys like him. Again the proposed contract would pay him 48.5 million over 5 years, that is a competitive offer. Gasol would basically be getting a similar deal to the one Bogut signed with the Bucks. I know you guys like him but really if you look at Pudgy’s career numbers he is not really worth a contract that pays him more than an average salary of 9.7 million a year.
The basic premise here is that Paul wants to be here, therefore we should parlay that into a contract that allows us to take a legitimate run at a Center as well. The idea that we should give him a max deal simply because he can get one elsewhere, does not fly with me. Why not try to get him for less if we can, we can always throw the bulk of our cap money, we do not need a good basketball man running the Knicks to do that, a chimp could offer Paul a max deal, we need a salesman who can get paul and save a few dimes to maybe get a Center as well.
yeah I think we can get Chris Paul, but not for $7 million.
I would not ever expect him to do that for us.
Anxiously awaiting the day my username will be appropriate
Paul will not sign for 7 million, unless the new CBA includes a massive rollback to contracts
Second, unless the new CBA also eliminates sign and trades, NOLA is gonna want something in return.
Paul is unrestricted, so it doesn't matter what New Orleans wants
They can have a TPE and some 2nd rounders if they’re lucky lol
Well, yeah that's what I meant
Although in retrospect, a couple of picks is a great deal for an possible extra year of Chris Paul.
Still, getting either Paul OR even Gasol for under 10 million is probably out of the question.
I think the knicks should find a way to hire Tannenbaum
he could get chris paul to sighn for 7 million……. my jets fans know what im talking bout.
i want the season...
just to watch clips of faried dunk… anyone see that clip from drew league? his armpit was at the rim.
otherwise, while there are “bright sides” to a missed season (rest?)… i enjoy watching the knicks too much to prefer waiting for stars i don’t even want in the first place.
faried has freakishly long armpits
I am sure Shumpy can do the same thing even though he has conventionally sized pits.
maybe next year...
they’ll include “armpit span” as a measurement at the combine. very important feature.
by bucketsncents on Aug 6, 2011 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
LOL! Chris Paul for $7 million.
That’s a knee slapper, Currence. Shit, if we have $6 mil left to sign a center why not make it Dwight Howard? Fuck Marc Gasol, whatever hypnotist we hire as GM should be reaching for the stars! All of the stars!
I expected a laugh Flossy but look at the premise not the numbers
I did not throw all the options out there in order to not have a fan post that read like War and Peace! The Basic Premise is we should try to convince paul to leave enough money on the table to go after a Center. Again maybe I should have spelled out to you that Less than max contracts give teams more flexibilty to structure the contract. Therefore Both Paul and Gasol’s deals can be “back loaded,” in order to fit under this years cap. So for example Gasol’s deal would actually be a 5 year 48.5 million deal which is pretty close to what Andrew Bogut and Andrea Bargnani are making now. Now if you think Gasol’s career 12.6 pts per game and 7.8 rebounds per game is worth more than a contract with an average salary of 9.7 Million, which is what I propose he be offered, then you are entitled to your opinion.
My original offer for Paul would be 5 years and 50 mil, now if we have to go hire then we would have to sign and trade. If we moved Douglas and Balkman in a sign and trade with NO, then Paul can get a 6 year deal worth 86 Million. now if that is not enough money then we need to look elsewhere for a point guard.
I could be wrong...
But didn’t the CBA proposal that you’re hypothetically working with here actually move more towards a hard cap as the years went on? Like the first year will benefit the players the most and leave more room to sing players, but the cap would get lowered as the years went on and the BRI would go more towards the owners?
The reason I ask this is because if I’m not mistaken, backloading Paul and Gasol’s contracts would put us more over the limit in the future
by WSD on Aug 8, 2011 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Presti at OKC is doing a lot of the same cap maneuver-y thing.
With Collison they actually did kind of the opposite. They front-loaded his contract and used up the rest of their available unused space. Theoretically that’ll get Collison his total amount due, while freeing up space later on for the Westbrooks and the Durants who took Carmelo extensions.
They frontloaded both Collison and "restructured" Perkins
but this can only be done by teams under the cap, and is basically not an option for the Knicks.
Not necessarily the case
The hard cap like the old salary cap would go up every year under the owners proposal which is why they are calling it a Flex cap now. The issue is the amount by which the cap grows will one be tied to revenue and two will not increase as much or as fast as the old cap. Now what will happen is that the Knicks will have less money to sign middle of the road players, and will have to look to sign more people to min contracts, which is actually what the owners want. The owners have a problem with the fact that guys like John Salmons and Corey Maggette are making 8-12 million a year, not the Chris Paul’s. It is these guys whose contracts they want to cut. The idea is basically play a few star players alot of money and everyone else makes as close to minimum as possible. So yes backloading a contract means that we will not have10 Million to throw at Armon Johnson in 2015. If Johnson wants to be a Knick he will probably have to take 2-3 million if the owners get their way.
If they roll back existing contracts
like Melo and Stat’s then there would be additional money freed up, no? Those two guys make what? $20 million each. So if they got rolled back 25% that would be an additional $10 million to throw at their good little buddy CP3. I also don’t think we need Gasol, I’m a big Jorts guy.
Yeah, sorry Currence, I agree with pretty much everyone here
I don’t think Paul can be had at that price. If we had 18.7 mil in cap space, there are some other good PGs available that summer like Jameer Nelson, Mo Williams, or even Felton if he wanted to come back, all of whom might be cheaper options.
There’s also the D-Will option, and if there is no season, he’s as good as gone from NJ and I think he’s more likely to sign for less money. He was traded from Utah because there were reports that he had made it known that he would like to play in NY. This is a bit of a stretch, but he’s not as highly regarded as Paul so there’s a chance he won’t receive as high of offers.
But yeah, we could try to get guys like Nelson or Williams who I think would fit here really well, and then use that money to offer a higher price to a good center like Marc Gasol.
But again, like everyone else on here, I’d rather get to enjoy basketball this season than sign those guys
I would prefer a season too, but
if they don’t play it would also be one less year of pounding on Amar’e’s knees and back while waiting for the cavalry in the form of Dwight or Dwill or Gasol or CP3 or whoever to arrive. I really think he was overused last season and it hurt the team in the end.
Why go after less, if you can negotiate a deal with Paul that works.
That is my point. Paul wants to be here, why not convince him to leave a little money on the table in order to put a better team around him. Why is Paul even an option folks. New Orleans will pay him his money if he chooses to stay. Paul wants out of NO because he does not believe he can win a Championship there. So obviously going to a team that already has Stoudemire and Anthony increases his chances of winning a title. With that in mind, Paul may be willing to negotiate a deal that allows the Knicks to also have a little cash to try and fill the hole at the center position. Remember the Knicks are in a different position now. We had to give Amar’e a max deal because he was not coming to a 29 win team without it. Melo already had his money on the table and he was not going to walk away from it, especially when he could have gotten it in Denver, or if he was traded to New Jersey or LA. So we had to bite the bullet on those salaries. We do not have to bite the bullet on Paul unless we want to. Because you are right there will be other options at point, we could sign one of the guys you listed, we could bring back Billups, or because we are under the cap we could trade for someone.
Yeah well I gave it a shot for yall
Better hops Chauncey’s legs hold up because we do not have enough money to outfit a team otherwise.
Wh...wh....WHAT?!
I humbly disagree. Chris Paul’s impact on the game compared to Marc is basically a meteor vs a strikingly shaped boulder striking the Earth. I wish I could watch the NBA through your eyes. It must be a magical journey.
by GAx on Aug 8, 2011 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah
Yeah Chris Paul should make like 30 million on 1 year deals if we’re talking about value. If there is no season, it would not be great for the Knicks because no one would give a shit about the NBA and it would be St. Johns this and Syracuse that.
I am disappointed in you guys,
The issue is not whether we should hope for missed games or a missed season, but rather how would the Knicks options be effected if there was a missed season. A missed season puts Paul in play which probably does not happen if there is a season this year as he is likely to be traded to a team that will want an extension. It also puts some Centers in play who likewise would be off the table. Gasol, Deandre Jordan, and even Greg Oden would all be in play because they would all be unrestricted free agents. With that type of situation, Just giving Paul a max deal just because does not make sense, especially when we have a chance to possibly plug two holes in our roster instead of one.
Maybe even Tyson Chandler!
I understand your points and they’re not idiotic or anything; I think they’re good points. However, I just personally feel like I’d rather get to watch our team this season win 40-something games and get swept in the 2nd round than not get to watch them at all and then maybe have a shot at signing two really great players
by WSD on Aug 8, 2011 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Lord Currence Confused?
You suggest D’Antoni being resigned to prove himself.
He has already proven himself over the years in the NBA.
At best a college coach.
Dolan is smarter then you think. He may like D’Antoni as you suggest.
He already knows you cannot win a NBA Championship with him.
Getting M.Gasol is the right answer. Getting rid of D’Antoni is also the right answer.
I will see you soon at the Barclay Center.
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