The Knicks have been leaning pretty hard on Carmelo Anthony in fourth quarters.
by Seth on Jan 8, 2012 7:11 PM EST
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How 'bout some stats to digest with your evening biscuits and whey? Jared Zwerling, whose Knicks coverage so far this season has been fantastic, rounded up some quarter-by-quarter scoring figures from the Knicks' first eight games. The order of the leader board isn't surprising at all-- Carmelo Anthony leads the team in the first and fourth quarters, while Amar'e Stoudemire produces the most points in the middle two quarters (when Melo tends to get his rest and/or sit because of foul trouble). What stands out-- though perhaps it's not all that surprising-- is the sheer drop-off from Melo to the next guy in fourth quarter scoring. Behold:
Fourth Quarter
Anthony -- 10.1 points
Shumpert -- 3.3 points
Chandler -- 3.0 points
Stoudemire -- 2.7 points
Fields -- 1.6 points
Recall that Melo pumped out a 17-point fourth quarter in the opening day win over the Celtics, and also scored 22 in the final frame of that miserable Bobcats loss, so that's probably where he gets a boost in this small sample size. Those 10.1 per, Zwerling says, put Melo atop the entire league in fourth quarter scoring.
The Knicks have actually done pretty well in fourth quarters this season (at least off the top of my head. I am way too relaxed to look up stats right now), but Melo averaging 10 points and the next-best guys averaging 3 apiece seems less than ideal. Last night's game showed how much deadlier the Knicks are when they spread the shots around rather than count on Melo to thrive in isolation (though, to be fair, he's pretty good at it).
Anyway, this isn't a huge deal, but it's worth noting, and it's probably something Mike D'Antoni would like to adjust as the season progresses. Or maybe not. I have no idea. Maybe he'll see this and be like "I SPECIFICALLY TOLD NONE OF YOU BESIDES MELO TO SCORE EVER" and start throwing nickels at Iman Shumpert or something. One never really knows if the people who actually influence these things share our opinions.
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Haha @ Nickels
I must admit, those stats are pretty alarming at first sight. Though it does seem like Melo thrives on the 4th quarter pressure. While most people will say that we should adjust, I think it’s fine as it is. As long as the other guys are ready to pick up the slack if need be.
We all know none of those nickels would hit Shump anyway.
He’d just Shump out of the way.
by tkow on Jan 8, 2012 8:37 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
10 points might seem like a lot, but break it down this way...
a three pointer, an and 1 drive, and 2 jumpers. that’s 4 baskets made in 12 minutes, one every 3 minutes. Doesn’t seem unreasonable to me. As long the efficiency is high and it’s not taking him 15 shots to get those 10 points, I have no problem with this. I’m more concerned with how to get STAT into the 6-7 point 4th quarter scoring range.
Yeah, that's fair
But on average, he’s doing that, and Amar’e’s hitting one shot and a free throw and that’s it, ya know? It’s not so much the ten points as it is the drop-off thereafter. (Also, it’s really not a big deal. Just thought it might be of interest.)
I agree
our guards need to find STAT in positions where he can score efficiently and in rhythm. It all comes back to defense and ball movement. DWIMD?
by Jeff Van Gumby on Jan 9, 2012 4:20 AM EST up reply actions
Melo scoring 10 in the 4th is no problem
We just need to get the other 4 guys on the floor scoring 10 as well. With 50 point fourth quarters, we’d be hard to beat.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
D'Antoni would not mind 50 point 4th quarters
He’d be the first to say hey if we all share the ball everybody should score.
by Robert Curre on Jan 9, 2012 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
now that shumpert is starting
the game is going to be easy for landry and stoudemire.
stoudemire can obviously carry a team if he needs to. he hasn’t done it in the past 6 games, or whatever it is. but its whatever really. if he gets a few easy dunks, tip ins, lay ups, and the like, he’s gonna start canning that mid range jumper. if we can keep the ball moving and not care where the points come from, we’re gonna be able to find the mismatches or openings against the other teams.
we’re working toward figuring it out. slowly but surely. getting back into game shape. i’m encouraged if anything. because the odd trend will break. and we will be normal soon. and our normal is gonna be ridic.
/// aighttho.com \\\/// twitter.com/aighttho \\\
yeah i think this is right
all of the pieces are starting to fall into place. the first few games were awful, but i think we’re going to get away from the “stand around and watch melo chuck” offense now that the rotation is starting to settle in. and to think that we’re getting baron davis at some point? this could be really exciting!
…but i’m still cautious about the whole thing. let’s see how this upcoming Bobcats game looks and see if we made any real progress.
by latrell chokewell on Jan 8, 2012 9:17 PM EST up reply actions
yea i mean...
switching shumpert in at the starting point guard only really fixed one problem: lack of penetration. there’s still so much to work on.
and you know, hopefully toney still has some confidence left, because he could be a very useful part of this ball club. still ironing out the kinks, still gotta get healthy. its gonna be a tough year. but the camaraderie and intangibles seem to be in place. its just a matter of getting the esp with one another.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
what's the likelihood that
management (not Pringles cause he probably doesn’t have the heart to do it) trades TD away this season?
My heart and head are at war
posi..tive ....thoughts..?
@krishhhayyy
oh god i hate this question
because, really, what could we get? we already have minimum salary specialists, young prospects at basically every position, and i can’t imagine that someone trades a PG who can dish for TD, who usually can’t.
so that leaves us with, like, trade exceptions and second round picks, which is a pretty awful return. i’d rather just keep DWTDD. so i hope the odds are pretty damn low.
by latrell chokewell on Jan 9, 2012 2:25 AM EST up reply actions
i don't think he's fallen out of favor
d’antoni understands streakiness better than a lot of coaches out there. and even tho toney struggled to start the season, he’s not gonna be as bad as he was. and he has less pressure off the bench.
if he does get traded it just for middling depth (possibly someone who could come in and play both forward spots) or a late first round-early second round draft pick.
i don’t think we’re close to trading toney right now. something would have to really bowl us over.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
Douglas is not out of favor.
D’Antoni realizes that he needs him. and Beleive me folks the Knicks are going to need Douglas to DWTDD even when we get a healthy Baron Davis on the court. Douglas is still going to need to play considerable minutes and play effectively if the Knicks are to reach their stated goals this season.
Same with Landry, that is why I would suggest people temper their sentiments some, because both Douglas and Fields will be needed this season for considerable minutes regardless if they start or come off the bench.
by Robert Curre on Jan 9, 2012 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
Check out this Toney quote:
“Once I get my rhythm, I’ll be fine,” Douglas said. “Nothing changes for me. Just go out there and play and do what Toney is capable of doing.”
DWTICOD. Love it.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
by fuhry on Jan 9, 2012 11:08 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It depends
If Toney is insistent that he be a point guard, I think we’ve got a problem. But I don’t think he is. I think that he’s one of those guys that played the point in college becuase he knew, at his size, it was his best ticket to get drafted in the first round. But now that he’s here, he needs to move off that mindset, becuase the guy can score and defend and works better as a complementary piece – as a short shooting guard. He’s at a disadvantage defensively in that role against some guys, but quickness and strength are more important there than 3 inches.
D’antoni talks a lot about guys getting their confidence knocked down and how you have to build it back up in practice. I think Toney will be OK.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
well
good. That made me feel better.
http://memegenerator.net/cache/instances/400x/9/9476/9704325.jpg
posi..tive ....thoughts..?
@krishhhayyy
by gymtanlandry on Jan 9, 2012 11:07 AM EST up reply actions
i think you're right
but i would like to point out that toney transferred colleges when he was told they wanted him to play off the ball
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
Yeah but
if he had played shooting guard in college I don’t think he’d ever have been picked in the first round and might never have made it to the NBA. It was the hope that Toney could play the point in the NBA that moved him into the first round of the NBA draft into guaranteed salary territory.
Without that he might be playing in Europe. But I do think that he’s got a future as a 2 in this league, because he’s a good team player, very coachable, willing defender, and he can score efficiently. Particularly on a team like the Knicks with a high scoring guy at the 3.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
True
When you are under 6’4 you better be able to show that you can play some point, if you hope to make it to the next level, because that is where coaches will try to get you to play. That is why guys like Randolph Childress and Juan Dixon who were big time scorers in college never stuck in the NBA they were shooting guards in point guard bodies.
Yes
but I do think there’s some injustice in the predisposition coaches and GM’s seem to have when it comes to the size of shooting guards. I think that a lot of times a guy who’s between 6’ and 6’4" might be able to play the 2, if they’re strong and quick and skilled and smart. But I wonder how many guys that size even get a chance, while guys who are over 6’5" but maybe can’t even shoot or play D get chance after chance.
I mean, right now, there aren’t that many great shooting guards in the league, and I wonder if this is why. This has been going on since Michael Jordan came to prominence. Even back then, remember, Starks was bagging groceries because someone thought that he had to be a point guard at 6’3", and cut him because he couldn’t play there.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
I think it fixed another problem as well, on the defensive end: Too much penetration
If Shumpert’s starting and playing 30+ min next time we see the Celtics Rondo will not drop 30+.
by SweatbandProliferation on Jan 9, 2012 2:49 AM EST up reply actions
I wouldn't say that
1. Rondo is very good
2. The strategy when you play the Celtics should always be to turn Rondo into a scorer. The problem is you cannot let him get 30 and 10+ assists.
Rondo's got Toney's number
But he’s got a lot of guys’ number. I’ll reserve my opinion until I see Shump guarding him some more.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
I agree, which is why I said he'll keep him from dropping 30+
Of course Shump is still very much a rookie and he’s not going to be able to stop Rondo completely, Rondo is a force. However where Toney failed miserably I think he can at least mitigate his ability to penetrate and keep him closer to 20 than 31.
by SweatbandProliferation on Jan 9, 2012 6:17 PM EST up reply actions
One other advantage Shumpert has on the offensive end over Toney is that he seems to just have a better feel for it
As a PG we don’t see as much stagnation with Shump in general. Besides penetrating he has much better vision than TD does, he is less of a chucker, his overall mentality is to get baskets at or near the rim as opposed to Toney who seems content to work around the perimeter. He might not be the pure PG we need to really exploit the talent on the offensive end (hopefully B Diddy) but he is the best option at the moment, and not a bad one either.
by SweatbandProliferation on Jan 9, 2012 2:53 AM EST up reply actions
Basically...sometimes when TD's running the point it's like he's a headless chicken
by SweatbandProliferation on Jan 9, 2012 3:00 AM EST up reply actions
Sometimes?
I actually don’t think Toney has a chucker’s mentality at all. But because he isn’t naturally aggressive pushing the action and getting penetration, the offense stagnates and he ends up taking out of rhythm shots because the shot clock’s running down and he can’t get a better one.
I’m OK with Toney shooting becuase Toney’s a pretty good shooter. He just has to be set up within an offense in rhythm.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
I agree
I don’t think Toney’s a chucker at all. I think he just doesn’t shoot well off the dribble if he’s been handling the ball for the majority of the game.
Like, TD can knock down some step-back 3’s off the dribble, but when he’s running an offense and trying to create for others and stuff, those shots don’t seem to go in unless they’re direct catch-and-shoots.
I don’t know, that’s my view of it anyway
KNICKS NOW
http://nyknicksnow.blogspot.com/ - check it out!
The problem is high percentage shots
Toney shoots better off the ball in general because he gets higher percentage shots. When he plays the point he doesn’t produce the same quality shots for himself that come when he plays off the ball in the flow of the offense. In fact it has been quality of shots that have plagued him and Landry. Neither has been getting a large number of shots in rhythm and in landry’s case he is getting fewer shots at the rim.
Yeah Landry's all about rhythm
If his catch-and-shoot game is out of rhythm then he can’t knock down shots.
But otherwise, Landry’s offensive game needs to be in a fast-paced system or with a good, natural point guard who can find him when he makes cuts in halfcourt sets.
KNICKS NOW
http://nyknicksnow.blogspot.com/ - check it out!
by WSD on Jan 9, 2012 3:31 PM EST up reply actions
Melo scores a lot of pts in the 4th quarter BECAUSE HE TAKES A LOT OF SHOTS!
Chandler makes like 69.7% of his shots, but Melo, Douglas, & Amare are not team players and will NOT pass the ball!
Walker & Fields field goal % are comparable to Melo, but they just don’t get their touches.
Glad we don’t have a truse 2 guard, because he would be crying for the ball as well!
The only reason Fields and Walker have a decent FG% is because of Melo and STAT
They would shoot 10% from they got the same attention from defenses that Melo and STAT get. Our two players that “will NOT pass the ball” combined for 11 assists against Detroit.
i'm not trying to take shots at fields and walker
But to compare them to Melo and STAT because of their FG percentage is insane lol. There is nothing wrong with playing off of a super stars.
hard to say that fields and walker are in the same league
it’s a diss to Fields to say that. Let’s remember he was in strong contention for Rook of the Year…
posi..tive ....thoughts..?
@krishhhayyy
Fields has trouble even hitting wide open shots
He has never shown the ability to hit contested shots, or score in isolation. In all honesty, Walker has a better offensive game.
I think other people see that
Landry gets inside his own head. A lot like TD. His footwork getting to the basket has been the only thing scoring him points. I agree that he’s lacking, but we’ve seen him have great NBA results in points scored and we haven’t seen Walker do that.
Don’t get me wrong, though, I love Walker
posi..tive ....thoughts..?
@krishhhayyy
Fields does other things well
But I really don’t like his offensive game very much. I think that Walker has a better 3-point shot, a better handle, and is a better finisher. Fields tries more on defense, is a better rebounder, and a better passer. Overall, Fields is a better player. But most of his scoring came on came on fastbreaks with Felton running the offense, cuts to the basket, and wide open 3’s when his feet are already set. So far, he hasn’t been able to adjust to the halfcourt offense. Hopefully he is able to improve offensively. But I haven’t seen it yet.
I have a lot more patience with Fields than I do with say Toney Douglas because those skills and effort that you mention
And i do believe that he will improve offensively from his showing so far this season. We should keep in mind that he is still a very young developing player in a relatively new and changing system, his shot has been tweaked and he still isn’t comfortable with it. He’s had a real bad start to this year, shooting 20.8% (!!) from 3-point range…that’s definitely going to improve, and when it does so will his confidence and his overall game. It might not be ROY Landry but it’ll be Landrier.
by SweatbandProliferation on Jan 9, 2012 3:07 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah, Fields has been struggling for awhile now but he deserves a chance
Hopefully he can turn it around. I think that having him play more SF when Melo is on the bench could help him. SG isn’t really his natural position. He has shown flashes of “the old” Landry, but he hasn’t put it together for an entire game yet. Douglas’s lack of improvement is really frustrating. Still makes rookie mistakes, is inconsistent from the perimeter, can’t seem to ever finish on the fastbreak, and has no PG skills.
One thing that hasn't been said yet about the improvement in Shump starting
Is how he pushes the pace better. He’s not that much of a better passer than TD, but if he pushes the ball, he knows he can score, and if the defense reacts to it then he can make a little drop off pass to somebody else running the floor.
Pushing the ball on offense helps Landry’s game because he’s simply so much better in the fast break or playing with a rhythm. It helps Stat’s game and Tyson’s too because they run the floor better than a lot of other PFs or Cs
KNICKS NOW
http://nyknicksnow.blogspot.com/ - check it out!
It's all about the rhythm and the confidence
It makes shit work. Toney’s hesitancy makes shit not work. Toney and Fields and Amar’e will be fine, being the recipient of someone else (Shump and eventually Baron) pushing the action.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
Fields just tries so damn hard
I think TD handles being benches better than Landry ever could. Not mentally tough enough. It could be really bad for him, but then again why would you bench Shump after the way he’s performing now….
Ah, decisions, decisions
posi..tive ....thoughts..?
@krishhhayyy
by gymtanlandry on Jan 9, 2012 11:19 AM EST up reply actions
landry can take it
simply because he’s a hard worker. he also seems to be a total team player. whether starting or coming off the bench, i think fields will always give his all.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
It's not Fields' confidence that is the problem
He is not getting a high percentage of good looks in rhythm. Shooting is about establishing a rhythm and Fields doesn’t get consistently the type of touches that give him a rhythm. And when you are not in rhythm then even a wide open long range jumper is not an easy shot to make. When Fields can get back to getting a few high percentage looks at the rim, he will get his rhythm and his jumpshot will get better.
I agree....
about the pushing the ball aspect. It definitely improves the offense as a whole.
But i strongly disagree that Shumpert is not that much better a passer than TD. Granted it’s been a small sample size, but he has shown he is head and shoulders better than TD passing the ball. I counted at least six or seven passes in the Pistons game that there was NO WAY Douglas would have made. He would have simply shot the ball.
I love TD and I think he has a role on the team, but Shumpert sees the floor in a way that TD never will. Not a knock on TD — just a fact.
oh absolutely
you can see it just on plain old swing passes. he just puts a lot more zip on the ball than toney. it seems like every pass toney makes is lofted.
even that behind the back to chandler for the dunk the other day. shit was a crumby pass.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
that could be true but
Fields definitely has a better all around game.
sreh ladien e' ta janjia
by Lord Smackington on Jan 9, 2012 9:37 AM EST up reply actions
Chandler's FG% is that high cuz of dunks
but you knew that already.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
no, what chandler is really good at
is isolating from the right mid post
Anxiously awaiting the day my username will be appropriate
what's really impressed me about chandler is how he's modeled his game after kobe bryant
and has returned this year with a deadly turn-around fade-away. really amazing he keeps his fg% so high with all that flash. truly one of the all time greats.
Anxiously awaiting the day my username will be appropriate
damn strong finisher
sreh ladien e' ta janjia
by Lord Smackington on Jan 9, 2012 9:37 AM EST up reply actions
strong fiber too
"they try to do what he do, and been where he's been, but they get folded in two.....he's the dude"
fade'n em all like Jamal!
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
Still though
Lee is playing well for the Warriors so far this year. Has had a couple of stinker shooting games, but most of his games have displayed the efficient shooting and strong rebounding we enjoyed from David when he was here.
Good to see him doing well. He’s a good player and a good guy, and I’d hate to see him stuck with a ‘bust’ label and become the butt of jokes.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
Yeah I have no hate for D-Lee
Although I do kinda miss the curly-headed, rep mop D-Lee who dove for balls and wasn’t as polished. Faux-hawk Lee who can score off the dribble and knock down jumpshots and doesn’t do as much dirty work isn’t as enjoyable to me
KNICKS NOW
http://nyknicksnow.blogspot.com/ - check it out!
Most of of Chandler's points somes from alley oops from Melo/Shump
and get fould from passes from melo. Chandler would not be able to stay in the paint and get to basket easily if not for amare and melo.
Amar'e was really struggling early in the season
He also missed a couple games (meaning Melo took a lot more 4th quarter shots), and sat out most of the 4th quarter against the Wizards. Melo is our go to guy, but I expect expect things to balance out a bit as the season goes on.
Two Man Game
I personally would like to see STAT-n-Melo go none stop PnR in the 4th quarter. Last yr STAT lead the league for a good portion of the year in 4th qtr scoring and would love to see STAT-n-Melo combined average 16.5 ppg in the 4th qtr. So the ball is still in Melo’s hands and he can decide to shot or pass to a rolling or popping STAT. I can not see a team stopping that in the 4th qtr especially once the knicks are in the Bonus.
I'm from New York, I always been a fan of the Knicks!!!!!
thats it!
not one or the other..but BOTH. Kind of like a vanilla chocolate swirl ice cream cone
"they try to do what he do, and been where he's been, but they get folded in two.....he's the dude"
A Double Cone
So both guys can get their licks
I'm from New York, I always been a fan of the Knicks!!!!!
by Twosevenstreet on Jan 9, 2012 3:31 PM EST up reply actions
Seth! You're on vacation!
Stop posting and start toasting—-marshmallows, that is! You’re in Colorado, enjoy sitting by the fire, skiing, and what not.
I just think it’s important that you to get the rest you’ll need for the Knicks’ run through June…yeah I said it, Melo & Co will be makin’ s’mores out of the competition before too long. It just takes time for the different ingredients to heat up and become a cohesive, delicious fireside snack! Let me explain my dessert-basketball metaphor further in an unnecessary fashion:
I mean, hey, come on…let’s be real for a second. Everybody knows that a graham cracker, cold pieces of chocolate, and an unmelted marshmallow is a pretty gross combination…but put it through the fire and you’ll get something. That’s the way I feel about this year’s squad.
"Why does green mean that's the color green? Why can't you say another word for green being green? Know what i'm saying?" - Stephon
by ny knickerbocker on Jan 8, 2012 10:19 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
You're killin' me, Smalls!
"Why does green mean that's the color green? Why can't you say another word for green being green? Know what i'm saying?" - Stephon
by ny knickerbocker on Jan 9, 2012 12:03 AM EST up reply actions
I love you for this reference. I say it all the time but it just ends up offending people.
Sometimes I think I’m the only one who ever saw that movie.
Fish Fingers give me a break.
by GAx on Jan 9, 2012 1:46 AM EST up reply actions
Posting and Tebowing?
I'm from New York, I always been a fan of the Knicks!!!!!
by Twosevenstreet on Jan 8, 2012 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
As aggravating as that guy has been as a sports news figure over the last few...well, FOREVER...
I gotta say, Timmy is entertaining as hell. What a game tonight.
"Why does green mean that's the color green? Why can't you say another word for green being green? Know what i'm saying?" - Stephon
by ny knickerbocker on Jan 9, 2012 12:04 AM EST up reply actions
If Jorts would take up tebowing
He could be elbowing and tebowing by year’s end.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
Bogans?
Is Bogans to the knicks legit?
If so, when everyone is healthy the following rotation would be pretty deep.
Diddy (20), Shump (20), Bibby (8)
Bogans (16), Douglas (16), Shump (8), Fields (8)
Melo (36), Fields (12)
STAT (34), Balk (8), JJeff (6)
Tyson (30), Jorts (12), JJeff (6)
Im sorry but that is a pretty good rotation with great depth.
I'm from New York, I always been a fan of the Knicks!!!!!
A great bench is overrated. A solid bench to complement a fantastic starting lineup isn't.
I think Knicks would be solid with Bogans and even moreso with Kmart if that materializes.
Meant to mention
That the Kenyon Martin twitter account referenced previously was revealed to be a fake. Still seems like a possibility, but figured it was pertinent.
Also by my previous comment
I meant that the Bogans rumors haven’t been followed up/confirmed. Seems like it’s not happening.
Different players
Bogans is sort of like Deshawn Stevenson but probably not as crazy. I’d rather have Bogans off the bench than Walker, to be honest
KNICKS NOW
http://nyknicksnow.blogspot.com/ - check it out!
by WSD on Jan 9, 2012 1:00 PM EST up reply actions
Im not high on kmart righ tnow.
Not taht he isnt a good backup…but the fact that Jorts has played phenominal on defense WITHOUT fouling, has range, and hustles hord. What else does martin bring? Not old kenyon martin, but new, old, kenyon martin
"they try to do what he do, and been where he's been, but they get folded in two.....he's the dude"
Seth
Shump would rub MDA thrown nickels into more dimes.
I'm from New York, I always been a fan of the Knicks!!!!!
Shump in second!
Yeah buddy!
But really, looks like STAT could use some good looks in the 4th, especially after his prolific swooping and hooping in the fourth quarter last season.
Shump as PG = good things
we saw Amar’e doing MUCH more in the paint because we had a competent PG. I love TD but he’s not showin up to play. Shump Shump found Amar’e (and others) around the basket and because we have the talent, we were able to produce points from it
Shump’s numbers will increase as time goes on because really he’s only played TWO 4th quarters because he got injured in the 3rd of the home-opener. I very much look forward to this. Yeeeess.
And Ty, well, did what he was paid to do. Muscle under the bucket and big D. Gotta say, his intangibles like contributing to team energy and being that “unifying” presence are damn good things.
posi..tive ....thoughts..?
@krishhhayyy
i'm just curious
when baron davis gets back (assuming he’s still got it…)- is shump gonna usurp landry’s spot?
/// aighttho.com \\/// twitter.com/aighttho \\
probably
but not right away. Davis will need to keep his minutes down early as he plays himself back into game shape. Working out on the side is one thing, even scrimmaging against team mates you can do when you are not 100% because guys nly go half speed in scrimmages but, for him to play well in games he will have to get into shape and that will take a couple of weeks. Consider Bibby, D’Antoni basically said Bibby was not in shape when he came to camp, which led to his back injury. Bibby is actually starting to play some productive minutes because he is 1. feeling better and 2. Finally in game shape. Remember the jump shot is in the legs and if a player is not in shape, his shooting will bare that out.
by Robert Curre on Jan 9, 2012 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe, but
If Shump is our starting point guard until Baron returns, it doesn’t make much sense to have him be our starting 2. I think it messes with too many guy’s roles. I’d bring Shump off the bench when Baron comes back so that one of those two guys is at the point 100 percent of the time.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
Shump is not really a point guard though, but a real combo guard.
his game is the same if you play him at the 2 or the 1. It’s really about getting the guys that are playing the best on the court. Now if Davis comes back and the team is rolling with Shump and landry in the back court, then Davis might not start at all. Remember he is 32 and has a bad back, so keeping his minutes down can help keep him healthy for the playoffs and besides, Davis is probably more important in the 4th quarter where his experience can help the team close out games. Something tells me that you will see Davis play with probably all the backcourt buds when he returns including Bibby, especially if Bibby’s stroke from long range decides to stay long term.
by Robert Curre on Jan 9, 2012 11:04 AM EST up reply actions
1))Dizzle has a herniated disk. Not a “bad back.” Mattingly had a bad back. See below.
http://ktar.com/?sid=1292257&nid=828
2) When Dizzle gets back….hes starting.
i kinda feel like shump will start with davis.
either immediately or eventually.
but i think the coaching staff’s wet dream would be to start davis/fields. then have shumpert and douglas off the bench.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
no the wet dream is Davis/ Shump..
Who can defend the Bryant’s, Wades, derozan’s, Roses, Rondos better, Fields or Shump?
Who can dish better to Melo and Amare, Fields or Shump?
Who can create his own shot better, Fields or Shump?
Who’s better on fast break with B.Dizzle, Fields or shump?
For the last one
Fields is equally as good in the fast break as Shump is. I love ’em both, and Shump is quicker, but Fields is pretty damn athletic once he gets going and in transition Fields always makes great decisions.
Also, Davis is a real PG who can push the pace and hit Fields in the fast break or on cuts in halfcourt sets. TD and Shump could make a nice duo off the bench to bring energy, defense, and scoring, even if Shumpert does outweight Fields in most of the categories you named
KNICKS NOW
http://nyknicksnow.blogspot.com/ - check it out!
by WSD on Jan 9, 2012 1:03 PM EST up reply actions
This is by design.
When D’Antoni said he intended to use Carmelo like the 80s Celtics used Bird, the media jumped on this point forward thing, Larry Bird was not a point forward even though he would get a decent number of assists. Bird was a good passer, but not really the guy running the offense. What KC Jones convinced Bird to do is to help get his teammates involved especially a certain power forward who was a legit threat to score 30 anytime he got the shots in McHale (sound familiar? I think the Knicks have one of those guys at the 4). Bird’s job for the first 3 quarters was to help move the ball and basically bail out the offense when things stalled. In the 4th quarter however, Bird was the “closer,” His job was to carry the offense in the 4th. For those of you who remember Bird in his prime with the Celtics, you know that Bird might score 30 in a game, but come into the 4th quarter with 14-15 points, which mean he dropped 15 in the final 12 minutes. Now Carmelo has struggled to adjust to his new role early on and the Knicks offense has been very inconsistent, but he appears to be getting the hang of it. Expect Melo to lead the team in 4th quarter scoring all season. The key to success however is going to come from how well Melo helps to create shots for others in quarters 1-3. When the Knicks actually put everybody on the court and get them playing up to their capabilities this is a team with considerable fire power. Enough that if he does a good enough job, he may like Bird not even be needed in the 4th quarter because the Knicks will be blowing people out. the 84’ Celtics lead the league that season in double digit victories. Larry only averaged 24 pts a game largely because he had alot of 16 point nights because he had the entire 4th quarter off!
by Robert Curre on Jan 9, 2012 10:28 AM EST reply actions 8 recs
I agree...
Quarters 1-3: Facilitator and drought-stopper
Quarter 4: Closer
Very similar to how PJ used Kobe the last few years.
by The Monsieur on Jan 9, 2012 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
I have tried over all these years
to forget what Larry Bird did. But yeah, the guy was a great basketball player. Maybe if Carmelo dyed his mustache blonde……
Get The Frickin' Rebound
very well said
I think it was Bobby V who said: "You are never as good as you are when you are at your best, and you are not as bad as when you are at your worst."
Good informative post
Thanks
Fish Fingers give me a break.
by GAx on Jan 9, 2012 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
Just want to shout out
The NY Giants!!!!… Helluva game yesterday… won me some good money too! =).. Haven’t see defense like that in the playoffs in a long time… Time to rape and pillage Aaron Rodgers and the Packers next.
On another note, let’s go Knicks! Time to get back over .500 tonite!
loving the giants right now
dare i say that they are giving off very 2008 vibes right now?
Anxiously awaiting the day my username will be appropriate
I don't know why
but we seem to be reluctant to say that Iman could play PG effectively. And that he does what a PG is supposed to do. Maybe I missed a comment, but we should give him credit for taking instruction and doing something with it
posi..tive ....thoughts..?
@krishhhayyy
I'm not reluctant
I had doubts before the season as to whether he had that floor general mentality. But seeing him play, he’s got the brash confidence and fearlessness to go in there and mix it up. More than that, he seems to have the ability to make even wizened veterans like Melo, Amar’e, and Tyson believe. I’ve seen all three of those guys in interviews, when asked about Shump, they just can’t really talk him up and they can’t supress a smile. It’s like the kid has a presence.
The shooting, ballhandling and passing can be improved via repetition and practice, and certainly inefficiency could be a problem for him down the line. But in terms of how the kid’s head works? I think he’s got it.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
something shumpert seems to add
that i think was sorely lacked is talking on defense.
call me crazy but amar’e and melo don’t talk much. tyson seems to talk, and shumpert just doesn’t stop talking. he’s basically narrating the game as its played. that helps guys like stat and melo, because altho they aren’t great defenders- they have some skills. if they can be pushed to use them, they also seem like willing contributors to the defense.
shumpert unlocks that skill. amar’e still ball watches. but i’m saying.
shumpert is opening our collective chakras.
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
by stingy d on Jan 9, 2012 11:37 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Totally right about Amar'e and Carmelo
They have defensive skills, just not the instinct of how to use them so they need all the guidance they can get.
And
shumpert is opening our collective chakras.
That just nails it.
Get The Frickin' Rebound
you guys see this?
I think it was Bobby V who said: "You are never as good as you are when you are at your best, and you are not as bad as when you are at your worst."
by gbaked on Jan 9, 2012 11:57 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
G's!!!
MARE!!!!!!
<3!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
man i'm starting to love this team
Fish Fingers give me a break.
by GAx on Jan 9, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
We're Brothers we're happy and we're singing and we're colored..... Give me a High Five
I'm from New York, I always been a fan of the Knicks!!!!!
by Twosevenstreet on Jan 9, 2012 3:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
IT;S FUCKIN ADORABLEE!!!1!1!!!
All part of the Knicks big brother/little brother sponsoring program.
posi..tive ....thoughts..?
@krishhhayyy
Amare and Melo never yap
the only time they do is when they’re bitching and moaning about the officiating, which is a lot.
Last night, a comedian died in New York. Somebody knows why. Somebody knows
by Rorschach44 on Jan 9, 2012 12:25 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
AND 1!!!
x15
/// aighttho.com \/// twitter.com/aighttho \
by stingy d on Jan 9, 2012 12:27 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
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